Can it be definetly said, that Patrick Ewing is the best all-time sound C of all-time?

First topic message reminder :

It is not because I am a Knicks fan I am saying this and I am not saying that he is the G.O.A.T C to have ever played the game. Cause I would rank the Top 5, like this.

1. Lou Alcindor/Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
2. Bill Russell
3. Wilt Chamberlain
4. Hakeem Olajuwon
5. Shaq
6. Patrick Ewing.


However, outside of Hakeem Olajuwon there isn't any other C who has played the game that can compare to how all-around Patrick Ewing was.

Kareem - Had the range, but it wasn't all that well defined. Didn't look to possess the strength and defensive know-how Ewing had nor did he have Ewing's athleticsm. Ewing before the sore achilles tenden could throw it down on everyone. Even with age getting the better of him he was just so polished he still was great better than Hakeem when Hakeem was in his last years in Houston/Toronto.

Bill Russell - His offensive game was below average

Wilt Chamberlain - His heart and confidence came into question a lot, especially by Russell. Ewing was a Warrior, you'd know that he gave it his all. Plus, Wilt could not shoot free throws

Shaquille O'Neal - Has no shot, very dominant and has deceptive foot speed and an array of post moves. Just no shot.

Hakeem Olajuwon to me is the most versatile C in NBA history. His Dream Shake was just an amazing feat for a man his size to pull off countless times. He could defend, block, hit jumpers (However, not as good as Ewing's outside game). I think Ewing is the greatest jump shooting C who has ever lived.

Ewing also was a great defender, he could block, and his athleticism may have been better than Olajuwon's. Hakeem was by far the better dribbler though and could utilize finesse moves/physical ones in his offensive arsenal better than Ewing.

redskins> NFL

Oh yeah....the Bears can go 16-0 without Brian Urlacher (spelling?)

And the Redskins are so good with Clinton Portis always fading in the second half of the season...

way to ruin this thread guys......

Broncos are gonna be 2-0 after this weekend. So we will already have two more wins than Detroit has had in two years.

portis> your RB

moss/randle l> ur WR

Cambell> Your QB

Big baby>your DL

Are you really gonna count on freaking Kyle Orton?

Nenad wrote:

Bears>All

Colts Super Bowl 41 win.vs.Bears means Colts>Bears>NFL

VISA wrote:

Russel is overrated. his era was weak. he's still top 5 but not # 1

I would say he's the greatest center because of the following reasons

-He's the greatest defensive player in basektball,greatest shot blocker and man to man defender.At 6'9 Russell mastered the fundamentals,was the first great passing big man,was always great rebounder duo to his position and natural jumping ability,he never relied on stregth.He's not the greatest offensive center but 15 PPG isn;t bad.His highest scoring season was 18,9 PPG in 1962.He got his points from off boards,some shots and FTs

The thing that hurts Russell;s legacy is the league not counting the blocked shots and not having DPOYs.If they had Russell would have been the All Time Leaders in blocks and BPG,he would probably been the player with most DPOYs won that would be like 5-8

Bill is also the greatest winner that the game has seen,11 rings in 13 years including 2 as a coach-player.This is why this guy is so good and my reasons why i consider him teh greatest center of all time.Plus he has great acomplishments,good stats....

VISA wrote:

portis> your RB

moss/randle l> ur WR

Cambell> Your QB

Big baby>your DL

Westbrook > Portis
Alright...our WRs suck
McNabb > Cambell
Any DL > Albert (not in his contract year)

Darko wrote:

VISA wrote:

Russel is overrated. his era was weak. he's still top 5 but not # 1

I would say he's the greatest center because of the following reasons

-He's the greatest defensive player in basektball,greatest shot blocker and man to man defender.At 6'9 Russell mastered the fundamentals,was the first great passing big man,was always great rebounder duo to his position and natural jumping ability,he never relied on stregth.He's not the greatest offensive center but 15 PPG isn;t bad.His highest scoring season was 18,9 PPG in 1962.He got his points from off boards,some shots and FTs

The thing that hurts Russell;s legacy is the league not counting the blocked shots and not having DPOYs.If they had Russell would have been the All Time Leaders in blocks and BPG,he would probably been the player with most DPOYs won that would be like 5-8

Bill is also the greatest winner that the game has seen,11 rings in 13 years including 2 as a coach-player.This is why this guy is so good and my reasons why i consider him teh greatest center of all time.Plus he has great acomplishments,good stats....

I'm sorry...but just because he was a beast at defense doesn't make up for his average offense...
Hakeems' defense was almost just as good as Russel's and his offense was waaaaaay better than Bill Russel's...

YS wrote:

Darko wrote:

VISA wrote:

Russel is overrated. his era was weak. he's still top 5 but not # 1

I would say he's the greatest center because of the following reasons

-He's the greatest defensive player in basektball,greatest shot blocker and man to man defender.At 6'9 Russell mastered the fundamentals,was the first great passing big man,was always great rebounder duo to his position and natural jumping ability,he never relied on stregth.He's not the greatest offensive center but 15 PPG isn;t bad.His highest scoring season was 18,9 PPG in 1962.He got his points from off boards,some shots and FTs

The thing that hurts Russell;s legacy is the league not counting the blocked shots and not having DPOYs.If they had Russell would have been the All Time Leaders in blocks and BPG,he would probably been the player with most DPOYs won that would be like 5-8

Bill is also the greatest winner that the game has seen,11 rings in 13 years including 2 as a coach-player.This is why this guy is so good and my reasons why i consider him teh greatest center of all time.Plus he has great acomplishments,good stats....

I'm sorry...but just because he was a beast at defense doesn't make up for his average offense...
Hakeems' defense was almost just as good as Russel's and his offense was waaaaaay better than Bill Russel's...

Has Hakeem won 2 titles as a player and beeing a coach in the same time?No...

Wow Darko. How is Wilt overrated but Russell not?

Hakeem>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Russell. no question.

and with that said Tony; I have to give the "all-around" title to Hakeem. With Ewing a close second.

Darko wrote:

YS wrote:

Darko wrote:

VISA wrote:

Russel is overrated. his era was weak. he's still top 5 but not # 1

I would say he's the greatest center because of the following reasons

-He's the greatest defensive player in basektball,greatest shot blocker and man to man defender.At 6'9 Russell mastered the fundamentals,was the first great passing big man,was always great rebounder duo to his position and natural jumping ability,he never relied on stregth.He's not the greatest offensive center but 15 PPG isn;t bad.His highest scoring season was 18,9 PPG in 1962.He got his points from off boards,some shots and FTs

The thing that hurts Russell;s legacy is the league not counting the blocked shots and not having DPOYs.If they had Russell would have been the All Time Leaders in blocks and BPG,he would probably been the player with most DPOYs won that would be like 5-8

Bill is also the greatest winner that the game has seen,11 rings in 13 years including 2 as a coach-player.This is why this guy is so good and my reasons why i consider him teh greatest center of all time.Plus he has great acomplishments,good stats....

I'm sorry...but just because he was a beast at defense doesn't make up for his average offense...
Hakeems' defense was almost just as good as Russel's and his offense was waaaaaay better than Bill Russel's...

Has Hakeem won 2 titles as a player and beeing a coach in the same time?No...

Umm...yeah...like CBI brought up..
How is Wilt overrated....but not Russel?

CBI wrote:

Wow Darko. How is Wilt overrated but Russell not?

Hakeem>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Russell. no question.

and with that said Tony; I have to give the "all-around" title to Hakeem. With Ewing a close second.

Russell was 6'9,mostly of his opponents were on the same size.Willis Reed 6,9;Nate Thurmond 6'10,Walt Bellamy 6'9,Jerry Lucas 6'10.....He's the greatest defender,shot blocker and winner.If you had to say he;s better then Hakeem post those reasons and acomplishments whise.I already wrote the reasons i will put the stats and acomplishments

Well let's see.

Hakeem;

played in a tougher era
Had little to no help
played against GOOD centers
played in a time WITH a three second rule
greatest defender of all time
very consistent
again had no help, but still won two chips
did well enough in college to be picked number one overall
shall I go on?

All of that over Russell's 11 chips in the 60's... easily.

Career highlights and awards
-11× NBA Champion (1957, 1959, 1960, 1961, 1962, 1963, 1964, 1965, 1966, 1968, 1969)
-5× NBA MVP (1958, 1961–1963, 1965)
-12× NBA All-Star (1958–1969)
-3× All-NBA First Team Selection (1959, 1963, 1965)
-8× All-NBA Second Team Selection (1958, 1960–1962, 1964, 1966–1968)
-1× NBA All-Defensive First Team Selection (1969)
-1× NBA All-Star Game MVP (1963)
-NBA's 50th Anniversary All-Time Team
-NBA 35th Anniversary Team
-NBA 25th Anniversary Team
-2x NCAA Titles
-2x NCAA Player Of The Year
-One of the couple player ever in the NCAA to averge 20 and 20 in 2 statistical things

CBI wrote:

Well let's see.

Hakeem;

played in a tougher era
Had little to no help
played against GOOD centers
played in a time WITH a three second rule
greatest defender of all time
very consistent
again had no help, but still won two chips
did well enough in college to be picked number one overall
shall I go on?

All of that over Russell's 11 chips in the 60's... easily.

Bill did more,he defended better and won more.Face it

11 chips- he played on one of the few good teams in the f*cked up 60's
5 MVPs- he was big. that's all you needed to be in the 60's
12 all-stars- see "5 MVPS"
last statistic- he was big.... he had no troule getting boards

CBI wrote:

Well let's see.

Hakeem;

played in a tougher era
Had little to no help
played against GOOD centers
played in a time WITH a three second rule
greatest defender of all time
very consistent
again had no help, but still won two chips
did well enough in college to be picked number one overall
shall I go on?

All of that over Russell's 11 chips in the 60's... easily.

Thank you CBI for that in-depth breakdown.
Agreed!

face it? No Darko you face it..

Hakeem defended better. Because for one he played against centers. That were his size. And for two, if he played in the 60's I wouldn't be surprised if he had 14-15 chips.

If they had blocks,Russell would have probably been the all time leader.The way Russell entered,set the defensive marks for all others who came after him.

Besides that,he's was great rebounder with his position and natural jumping ability,most of his competion was at his size so he dominated against them,he was great all around center and passer.Bill created a lot of fast brakes which made the Celtics work and at the end it with this guy it produced 11 championships

One thing that is overlooked about Russell is his passing.With the numerious fast brakes,he had a lot of outlet passes and just really did it a lot.Not unselfish player,never carred about stats,the only thing he matter is win.

CBI wrote:

face it? No Darko you face it..

Hakeem defended better. Because for one he played against centers. That were his size. And for two, if he played in the 60's I wouldn't be surprised if he had 14-15 chips.

Hell,no...........He would have better stats but no way beeing a better center.Defense and winning,that what Russell did.He set his marks for everyone other that come

Hakeem Olajuwon was an animal he was like a PG in a C's body. The things that he can do and he was also dominant 2. He could play both sides of the game. Ewing is the better jump shooter and may be a little bit more athletic, but in everything else Hakeem owns big time. Hakeem seems like the wise choice as the game's most versatile C.

There is no such thing as a fast break in the 60's.. the game was played fast throughout the whole game.

Another reason why Russel's offensive and defensive numbers were inflated..

Yeah and Hakeem played defense and won too


Maybe if he had a team other than Kenny Smith in Houston he would have six rings like Jordan.